Raven did not actually regret having sex with Yuri at all, per se, and he does not feel particularly taken advantage of in that way. Like I mentioned on plurk a bit ago, about at the point when Yuri was injured Raven was already swiftly approaching "oh fuck it what could it hurt." Especially after Beauty's game. Then he was injured and in shock and grateful to Yuri, and he managed to keep up his normal joking deflection for about five seconds, but he really didn't have the energy for it so when Yuri pushed again he just gave in. And of course he enjoyed it a lot.
IF THAT HAD BEEN ALL he would have been a lot more stable... he would still have spent a lot of time thinking about it and wondering self-consciously if they were a Thing now or if he even wanted them to be a Thing, if it was just sex. And would probably have concluded it was just sex and that was fine with him. That is not really fine with him but he would likely have settled into that frame of mind and wouldn't have talked about it to anyone.
BUT Yuri left really obvious hickeys on his neck and basically told Ferris what had happened. Whichhh of course made that completely impossible because he had to talk about it with like four people over the span of a day. Ferris teased him about it having ~finally happened~ and stuff. He told Judith about it! Inara said that Yuri must be really important to him. He denied it was anything romantic to Beatrice and then felt super guilty and bad about it. SO BASICALLY he had no choice, it was obviously a Thing. And that he was kind of mad at Yuri for, because he felt really a) trapped by it, like he didn't have a say in what it meant to him, and b) like it was shutting down his potential relationships with other people.
THAT SAID HE WOULD NOT ACTUALLY HAVE MINDED ANY OF THAT if he felt like it was... even? He enjoyed getting the hickeys and he even enjoys their presence and that proof to everyone that Yuri has claimed him, on a base level. However he didn't feel like that was... real. Because he doesn't think Yuri cares about him that much to be that possessive of him! And Yuri has someone else! So he felt like he while he was in a spin thinking about Yuri constantly and wanting Yuri constantly and having everyone congratulate him or whatever, Yuri was probably just off doing his own thing casually, which is like. Exactly why he didn't want to get involved with Yuri to start with.
SO THAT WAS WHAT WENT INTO THEIR PARTY THREAD PROPER. Raven was doing his best to be casual and joking and "I need to go flirt with all the ladies." And then Yuri was like oh okay cool, and so Raven was like oh no I was right he doesn't actually care. THEN YURI GAZEBO'D HIM and they talked about things, and he actually expressed... some of what he was feeling. And then Yuri had feelings too and admitted to being trying, so Raven was like "...well okay maybe it's not that he doesn't care, maybe he's just a failure at feelings." AND I AM NOT SURE THAT'S FUNCTIONALLY BETTER but also Yuri was cute having feelings.
Thennnn there was the endgame thread where he was drunk! Which was after I Never where he got poked even more about Yuri, by Ferris and by Mitchell. ("Should I send out a bulletin?") And after Ferris suggested he should go have Yuri ~service him~. So he was actually... pretty mad at Yuri again in that thread, even from the beginning... but was also drunk and harried enough that he was like oh god fuck it if it's going to be like this anyway I might as well get sex out of it. I was actually laughing to myself a little that you could tell Raven was in a bad emotional state there because he was topping. >_> That is a slight exaggeration, he is capable of topping normally too, but he does it a lot more when he's either angry or disaffected enough that he doesn't care about the consequences of what he's doing. (See: stuff around the Don's death, Schwann.) His sweet-talking flirting was 100% unfortunately honest and slightly pointed because of that! It was definitely very much a "this is what you are getting into" thing.
So Yuri attempting to turn him down because he didn't want to take advantage of him was just. lol. He was like... THE ADVANTAGE HAS ALREADY BEEN TAKEN, YOU HAVE THE ADVANTAGE, MY ONLY PROBLEM IS THAT YOU ARE NOT DOING ANYTHING WITH IT. So pretty much the worst possible thing to tell him! Especially right after he'd challenged Yuri on whether he actually wanted to put the effort into it with him.
THAT... SAID... having sex is not actually a terribly better choice either because they didn't... actually resolve any issues there really, he just kept pushing until Yuri gave in, and clinging desperately to whatever Yuri can give him is another thing he really didn't want to do! And when he sobers up a little he will be like "oh god did I really... do that... how about I don't talk to Yuri ever again, that sounds like a good plan."
AND TO ANSWER YOUR OTHER QUESTION no Raven does not know the extent of Yuri's relationship with Vincent. At the moment he only kind of suspects that Yuri is involved with Vincent and is trying not to think about it too hard. Or at all. He probably could have... noticed... by now... given their exhibitionism... But I am assuming he has not because he would notttttt react well. Bothering him is an understatement, if he knew Yuri had someone else he loved and was still doing all this with Raven he would feel really betrayed and shut down and reject any further advances from Yuri. :'D I'm sorry Yuri, Raven is a romantic with monogamous tendencies and gets really jealous.
Is Yuri going to... tell Raven... about Vincent... at any point...
I mean, he will eventually, obviously, because he and Vincent are VERY public. He's not trying to keep it a secret or even consciously not telling him. A good opportunity simply hasn't come up.
A side note on telling Ferris... He honestly thought that by telling TE they would leave Raven alone, not tease him MORE. In retrospect he kicked himself for the hickies--it was a purely indulgent, possessive gesture at the time that he just really didn't think through.
Yuri... has no framework for monogamy. Like, AT NO POINT did it occur to him that Raven would want to be a monogamous Item. He and Vincent are very much "and then we each fucked off to do our own thing." So when they did it the first time Yuri was kind of puppyishly pleased with the situation like that was TOTALLY THE ONLY BARRIER THEY HAD. :D And now he is very doggedly resolving to do WHATEVER IT TAKES for Raven to walk away and have them be fine.
What does Raven think of Yuri being an emotional failure?
Well Raven does not really want to be a monogamous Item with Yuri, exactly, which is partly what kept throwing him when people tried to talk to him about it. Part of it is just that he doesn't think Yuri would do it in a million years, of course, but it is also that while his feelings for Yuri are ridiculously strong they are not... romantic in precisely that sense either? I mean he's romantic about it because he's a romantic, but at it's core it is more dedication/admiration/obsession than romantic love. But he doesn't know how to categorize that, since really in his head there is "the one person you love and dedicate yourself to" and "casual sex with people you don't really care about." This was accentuated by going "it's not romantic" to Beatrice and having her go "oho, so it's like that~" and him mentally going BUT NO IT'S NOT LIKE THAT EITHER. Obviously Yuri is a lot closer to the former than the latter, but rationally he does not want to dedicate himself to Yuri like that, due his desire to not depend on Yuri for everything ever as well as the fact that he still... loves women. And a few women in particular. Viscerally he does want to give himself to someone like that, though, and Yuri in particular because he owes him so much, so it is hard to avoid.
BUT ANYWAY Raven does not actually think Yuri is an emotional failure. He just thinks he's very good at walling off his feelings and denying their relevance, which is something that he's very familiar with, even if Yuri obviously does it in a different way than he does. So that was actually another one of those things that made him feel a camaraderie/on the level with Yuri! ~They can work things out together~ It was really a huge step. :|a He's just not really... together enough to do any calm working things out atm.
WHY DIDN'T YOU BELIEVE ME WHEN I WARNED YOU, YURI...
To have believed Raven he would have had to have been aware of his own limits and his own kind of emotional brokeness, which he just WASN'T at the time. He's a little more aware now, but... it's mostly a blind spot. And also... he really does want Raven. He would have no issues with having something with Raven on the same level that he has something with Vincent and he knows it would be hairy to work out but of course he doesn't understand how against Raven's nature that is.
Will Raven ever be able to take Yuri off the pedestal? If this ends badly could Raven ever hate Yuri?
WELL the pedestal is being knocked down fairly efficiently at the moment. It is amazing how well being annoyed and toppy at Yuri works for that. He would then have to figure out how he feels about him and how to deal with him in a more equal context though, and who even knows. I don't think he would actually hate Yuri ever, if nothing else because that would require distilling his feelings down from their complicated mess to something as simple as hate, but if it ends really badly he might try to cut himself off. :|a
If Raven managed to get someone to agree to be his girlfriend and told Yuri to lay off because he wanted to be monogamous what would Yuri do...
Yuri would 100% be okay and lay off and be totally happy for Raven and would ABSOLUTELY not go out of his way to make his life hard by teasing and whatnot. He'd only get kind of... tsun if Raven started drifting away, but he'd just repress it anyway. It is confusing that Raven keeps asking him what he wants because really, he just wants Raven the same way he's had Raven and he also wants to make Raven happy.
Tell me about Raven's feelings in this current thread.
OVERALL HIS FEELINGS IN THAT THREAD WERE REALLY MUCH THE SAME. From Raven's point of view he felt like he was mostly just reiterating things, not saying anything new. Whether Yuri understood it differently or whether how he approaches things will change is a different question of course. But really it was much the same as what he was feeling in the non-drunken party thread. How he will act in the future still depends on the balance between "I can't do this it isn't really what I want" and "fuck it I don't care I want something like this and I will take what I can get" and of course what Yuri does! LIKE IT HAS BEEN. He didn't really feel like anything was... actually resolved there, other than maybe actually communicating to Yuri the depth of his feelings finally.
But the one sort of... major swerve in the conversation was of course Yuri saying "I can't imagine feeling like that." BECAUSE THAT IS KIND OF... irreconcilable. Yuri not really knowing how he feels or not how to express his feelings, but working on it together with him, is one thing! BUT LIKE. Raven is still on some level willing to try to tone it down to a less obsessive level, but he didn't get any impression from Yuri that Yuri was actually interested in... toning it up. And he really can't handle Yuri being genuinely like "I don't really care either way" about it. If he's going to want Yuri as much as he does he wants at least some real desire and effort in return and it kind of sounded like there... wasn't. That. :|a BUT YURI DID AGREE EARLIER THAT THEY COULD WORK ON IT... BUT IS THAT EVEN A GOOD IDEA IF THEY ARE SO FAR APART... WHO KNOWS!! IT'S TIME TO SLEEP OFF HIS AFTERNOON HANGOVER.
To expand more on "take what I can get," another big part of Raven's conflict is that he really does often feel that anything he can get with Yuri is the best that he can get. While he does really want a dedicated romantic and sexual relationship with someone, he has like zero faith in himself to manage that, especially at the moment. So sometimes he's like... okay yes this is not the dedicated relationship I idealize and really want in my heart, but it is sex with someone I care a lot about, and that's a hell of a lot better than anything I managed before, whatever the downsides. MAYBE I SHOULD JUST ENJOY IT FOR WHATEVER IT IS LIKE EVERYONE KEEPS TELLING ME?
That is another thing that makes him feel like the feelings in their relationship are really uneven, though, because obviously that is not a concern for Yuri! Yuri has stated that plus or minus sex with Raven makes no difference to him, whereas for Raven it is functionally the difference between the best thing he's had ever and nothing. Add that to the romantic feelings or lack thereof on each of their parts and you get why he reacted so negatively to Yuri suggesting they could be on equal footing.
And that imbalance of feelings makes him feel really vulnerable. Although again I don't think that would really bother him as much if he felt like Yuri was... taking advantage of the vulnerability? To make his feelings into a terrible sex analogy, it is like he has stripped and laid himself out naked and wanting for Yuri, and Yuri is just sort of strolling by casually going "sure, do whatever you want, I don't care either way." The core problem here is not that he's naked and Yuri's not—while potentially awkward and obviously not equal, that could also be the opposite of a problem in the right circumstances. So likewise the problem is not the feelings imbalance being present exactly, it is that Yuri is not being a very attentive top about it. :|a Feelings top. THIS IS CLEARLY THE BEST ANALOGY EVER.
Because yes he loves Yuri a lot and now that they've had sex kind of wants to have sex with him all the time, and so even more than Yuri not returning those feelings he feels like Yuri is not even... appreciating them. Or him. Except when they are actually having sex and he can do things for Yuri, which is pretty much the most amazing feeling ever. And Yuri obviously enjoying himself with him and Yuri saying he wanted to get screwed senseless has reassured him that the desire in the relationship is not completely one-sided. BUT SEX CANNOT BE ALL YURI WANTS, Raven has no clue what he's doing with men and obviously cannot be the best lay ever. So that is why he keeps asking what Yuri wants... because he very much feels like he is in the more vulnerable position in this relationship, and would be pretty much willing to try just giving Yuri whatever he wants from him! Even if that's... camaraderie, occasional mild affection and sex on days that are a multiple of three. Or whatever. Knowing that he could try to settle himself to being happy with that much. But Yuri keeps saying that there's nothing he wants from him. :x Or that he just wants to do what Raven wants. And Raven is like... but what I really want is completely unreasonable to ask someone who doesn't want anything from me. IT MAKES IT HARD TO COMPROMISE.
I really am sorry Raven has so many feelings. But you better reverse me.
Yessss there was a lot of reiteration but it was kind of necessary because Yuri just DID. NOT. GET. Raven's hangup. For Yuri it was very simple:
1. You are important to me. 2. You clearly are attracted to me 3. I am also attracted to you
He really didn't understand why Raven kept accusing him of being casual. Like, I've acknowledged you're important to me. Of course I'm not being casual. Same thing with how Raven kept bringing up the fact that Yuri had someone else; he didn't see the bearing it had on his relationship with Vincent. Yuri's logic was very "Well we are definitely involved either way; sex is just a nice bonus." BUT he was only half telling the truth when he said he could take it or leave it. Yuri has super positive feelings about sex, so of course he wants physical intimacy with Raven and to make Raven feel good. He wasn't kidding when he said he didn't really need anything from Raven because he already HAS what he wants--that camaraderie.
Yuri knows he's in an advantageous position because Raven is 'his' and there's a power issue; he didn't know he had that kind of feelings advantage over Raven, which is why he flinched in the Endgame thread. He should NOT have that much power over someone, and no-one should be that invested in him. He tried to fix the situation by being vulnerable himself so it was kind of a cold bucket of water to the face when he realized that he was just too deficient. He couldn't understand Raven's feelings, just for lack of ABLE to feel that way. He doesn't even feel that way about Vincent.
Even if you stripped away his self-denial issues, Yuri just ISN'T a person who needs much. Or, rather, he gets what he needs by being a useful person. So fucking up Raven by not being able to give him what he wants is kind of a blow. He was basically AS VULNERABLE AS HE COULD POSSIBLY BE an it wasn't good enough. It's not that he won't return the depth of feelings, he just flat-out doesn't have those resources.
BRIEF NOTE: I mentioned in chan that Yuri is feeling more and more that Vincent is the only one who will have him. Sharon's heartgame ended up happening at a hilarious time because Yuri just keeps getting more and more entrenched into Vincent's world, and he's beginning to think that it's probably just for the best that Raven distance himself from him, since he himself is becoming more distant from Terca Lumireis.
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edgeofjustice) wrote2011-11-10 03:18 pm
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Raven did not actually regret having sex with Yuri at all, per se, and he does not feel particularly taken advantage of in that way. Like I mentioned on plurk a bit ago, about at the point when Yuri was injured Raven was already swiftly approaching "oh fuck it what could it hurt." Especially after Beauty's game. Then he was injured and in shock and grateful to Yuri, and he managed to keep up his normal joking deflection for about five seconds, but he really didn't have the energy for it so when Yuri pushed again he just gave in. And of course he enjoyed it a lot.
IF THAT HAD BEEN ALL he would have been a lot more stable... he would still have spent a lot of time thinking about it and wondering self-consciously if they were a Thing now or if he even wanted them to be a Thing, if it was just sex. And would probably have concluded it was just sex and that was fine with him. That is not really fine with him but he would likely have settled into that frame of mind and wouldn't have talked about it to anyone.
BUT Yuri left really obvious hickeys on his neck and basically told Ferris what had happened. Whichhh of course made that completely impossible because he had to talk about it with like four people over the span of a day. Ferris teased him about it having ~finally happened~ and stuff. He told Judith about it! Inara said that Yuri must be really important to him. He denied it was anything romantic to Beatrice and then felt super guilty and bad about it. SO BASICALLY he had no choice, it was obviously a Thing. And that he was kind of mad at Yuri for, because he felt really a) trapped by it, like he didn't have a say in what it meant to him, and b) like it was shutting down his potential relationships with other people.
THAT SAID HE WOULD NOT ACTUALLY HAVE MINDED ANY OF THAT if he felt like it was... even? He enjoyed getting the hickeys and he even enjoys their presence and that proof to everyone that Yuri has claimed him, on a base level. However he didn't feel like that was... real. Because he doesn't think Yuri cares about him that much to be that possessive of him! And Yuri has someone else! So he felt like he while he was in a spin thinking about Yuri constantly and wanting Yuri constantly and having everyone congratulate him or whatever, Yuri was probably just off doing his own thing casually, which is like. Exactly why he didn't want to get involved with Yuri to start with.
SO THAT WAS WHAT WENT INTO THEIR PARTY THREAD PROPER. Raven was doing his best to be casual and joking and "I need to go flirt with all the ladies." And then Yuri was like oh okay cool, and so Raven was like oh no I was right he doesn't actually care. THEN YURI GAZEBO'D HIM and they talked about things, and he actually expressed... some of what he was feeling. And then Yuri had feelings too and admitted to being trying, so Raven was like "...well okay maybe it's not that he doesn't care, maybe he's just a failure at feelings." AND I AM NOT SURE THAT'S FUNCTIONALLY BETTER but also Yuri was cute having feelings.
Thennnn there was the endgame thread where he was drunk! Which was after I Never where he got poked even more about Yuri, by Ferris and by Mitchell. ("Should I send out a bulletin?") And after Ferris suggested he should go have Yuri ~service him~. So he was actually... pretty mad at Yuri again in that thread, even from the beginning... but was also drunk and harried enough that he was like oh god fuck it if it's going to be like this anyway I might as well get sex out of it. I was actually laughing to myself a little that you could tell Raven was in a bad emotional state there because he was topping. >_> That is a slight exaggeration, he is capable of topping normally too, but he does it a lot more when he's either angry or disaffected enough that he doesn't care about the consequences of what he's doing. (See: stuff around the Don's death, Schwann.) His sweet-talking flirting was 100% unfortunately honest and slightly pointed because of that! It was definitely very much a "this is what you are getting into" thing.
So Yuri attempting to turn him down because he didn't want to take advantage of him was just. lol. He was like... THE ADVANTAGE HAS ALREADY BEEN TAKEN, YOU HAVE THE ADVANTAGE, MY ONLY PROBLEM IS THAT YOU ARE NOT DOING ANYTHING WITH IT. So pretty much the worst possible thing to tell him! Especially right after he'd challenged Yuri on whether he actually wanted to put the effort into it with him.
THAT... SAID... having sex is not actually a terribly better choice either because they didn't... actually resolve any issues there really, he just kept pushing until Yuri gave in, and clinging desperately to whatever Yuri can give him is another thing he really didn't want to do! And when he sobers up a little he will be like "oh god did I really... do that... how about I don't talk to Yuri ever again, that sounds like a good plan."
AND TO ANSWER YOUR OTHER QUESTION no Raven does not know the extent of Yuri's relationship with Vincent. At the moment he only kind of suspects that Yuri is involved with Vincent and is trying not to think about it too hard. Or at all. He probably could have... noticed... by now... given their exhibitionism... But I am assuming he has not because he would notttttt react well. Bothering him is an understatement, if he knew Yuri had someone else he loved and was still doing all this with Raven he would feel really betrayed and shut down and reject any further advances from Yuri. :'D I'm sorry Yuri, Raven is a romantic with monogamous tendencies and gets really jealous.
Is Yuri going to... tell Raven... about Vincent... at any point...
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I mean, he will eventually, obviously, because he and Vincent are VERY public. He's not trying to keep it a secret or even consciously not telling him. A good opportunity simply hasn't come up.
A side note on telling Ferris... He honestly thought that by telling TE they would leave Raven alone, not tease him MORE. In retrospect he kicked himself for the hickies--it was a purely indulgent, possessive gesture at the time that he just really didn't think through.
Yuri... has no framework for monogamy. Like, AT NO POINT did it occur to him that Raven would want to be a monogamous Item. He and Vincent are very much "and then we each fucked off to do our own thing." So when they did it the first time Yuri was kind of puppyishly pleased with the situation like that was TOTALLY THE ONLY BARRIER THEY HAD. :D And now he is very doggedly resolving to do WHATEVER IT TAKES for Raven to walk away and have them be fine.
What does Raven think of Yuri being an emotional failure?
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BUT ANYWAY Raven does not actually think Yuri is an emotional failure. He just thinks he's very good at walling off his feelings and denying their relevance, which is something that he's very familiar with, even if Yuri obviously does it in a different way than he does. So that was actually another one of those things that made him feel a camaraderie/on the level with Yuri! ~They can work things out together~ It was really a huge step. :|a He's just not really... together enough to do any calm working things out atm.
WHY DIDN'T YOU BELIEVE ME WHEN I WARNED YOU, YURI...
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Will Raven ever be able to take Yuri off the pedestal? If this ends badly could Raven ever hate Yuri?
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If Raven managed to get someone to agree to be his girlfriend and told Yuri to lay off because he wanted to be monogamous what would Yuri do...
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Tell me about Raven's feelings in this current thread.
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But the one sort of... major swerve in the conversation was of course Yuri saying "I can't imagine feeling like that." BECAUSE THAT IS KIND OF... irreconcilable. Yuri not really knowing how he feels or not how to express his feelings, but working on it together with him, is one thing! BUT LIKE. Raven is still on some level willing to try to tone it down to a less obsessive level, but he didn't get any impression from Yuri that Yuri was actually interested in... toning it up. And he really can't handle Yuri being genuinely like "I don't really care either way" about it. If he's going to want Yuri as much as he does he wants at least some real desire and effort in return and it kind of sounded like there... wasn't. That. :|a BUT YURI DID AGREE EARLIER THAT THEY COULD WORK ON IT... BUT IS THAT EVEN A GOOD IDEA IF THEY ARE SO FAR APART... WHO KNOWS!! IT'S TIME TO SLEEP OFF HIS AFTERNOON HANGOVER.
TELL ME YURI'S FEELINGS.
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To expand more on "take what I can get," another big part of Raven's conflict is that he really does often feel that anything he can get with Yuri is the best that he can get. While he does really want a dedicated romantic and sexual relationship with someone, he has like zero faith in himself to manage that, especially at the moment. So sometimes he's like... okay yes this is not the dedicated relationship I idealize and really want in my heart, but it is sex with someone I care a lot about, and that's a hell of a lot better than anything I managed before, whatever the downsides. MAYBE I SHOULD JUST ENJOY IT FOR WHATEVER IT IS LIKE EVERYONE KEEPS TELLING ME?
That is another thing that makes him feel like the feelings in their relationship are really uneven, though, because obviously that is not a concern for Yuri! Yuri has stated that plus or minus sex with Raven makes no difference to him, whereas for Raven it is functionally the difference between the best thing he's had ever and nothing. Add that to the romantic feelings or lack thereof on each of their parts and you get why he reacted so negatively to Yuri suggesting they could be on equal footing.
And that imbalance of feelings makes him feel really vulnerable. Although again I don't think that would really bother him as much if he felt like Yuri was... taking advantage of the vulnerability? To make his feelings into a terrible sex analogy, it is like he has stripped and laid himself out naked and wanting for Yuri, and Yuri is just sort of strolling by casually going "sure, do whatever you want, I don't care either way." The core problem here is not that he's naked and Yuri's not—while potentially awkward and obviously not equal, that could also be the opposite of a problem in the right circumstances. So likewise the problem is not the feelings imbalance being present exactly, it is that Yuri is not being a very attentive top about it. :|a Feelings top. THIS IS CLEARLY THE BEST ANALOGY EVER.
Because yes he loves Yuri a lot and now that they've had sex kind of wants to have sex with him all the time, and so even more than Yuri not returning those feelings he feels like Yuri is not even... appreciating them. Or him. Except when they are actually having sex and he can do things for Yuri, which is pretty much the most amazing feeling ever. And Yuri obviously enjoying himself with him and Yuri saying he wanted to get screwed senseless has reassured him that the desire in the relationship is not completely one-sided. BUT SEX CANNOT BE ALL YURI WANTS, Raven has no clue what he's doing with men and obviously cannot be the best lay ever. So that is why he keeps asking what Yuri wants... because he very much feels like he is in the more vulnerable position in this relationship, and would be pretty much willing to try just giving Yuri whatever he wants from him! Even if that's... camaraderie, occasional mild affection and sex on days that are a multiple of three. Or whatever. Knowing that he could try to settle himself to being happy with that much. But Yuri keeps saying that there's nothing he wants from him. :x Or that he just wants to do what Raven wants. And Raven is like... but what I really want is completely unreasonable to ask someone who doesn't want anything from me. IT MAKES IT HARD TO COMPROMISE.
I really am sorry Raven has so many feelings. But you better reverse me.
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1. You are important to me.
2. You clearly are attracted to me
3. I am also attracted to you
He really didn't understand why Raven kept accusing him of being casual. Like, I've acknowledged you're important to me. Of course I'm not being casual. Same thing with how Raven kept bringing up the fact that Yuri had someone else; he didn't see the bearing it had on his relationship with Vincent. Yuri's logic was very "Well we are definitely involved either way; sex is just a nice bonus." BUT he was only half telling the truth when he said he could take it or leave it. Yuri has super positive feelings about sex, so of course he wants physical intimacy with Raven and to make Raven feel good. He wasn't kidding when he said he didn't really need anything from Raven because he already HAS what he wants--that camaraderie.
Yuri knows he's in an advantageous position because Raven is 'his' and there's a power issue; he didn't know he had that kind of feelings advantage over Raven, which is why he flinched in the Endgame thread. He should NOT have that much power over someone, and no-one should be that invested in him. He tried to fix the situation by being vulnerable himself so it was kind of a cold bucket of water to the face when he realized that he was just too deficient. He couldn't understand Raven's feelings, just for lack of ABLE to feel that way. He doesn't even feel that way about Vincent.
Even if you stripped away his self-denial issues, Yuri just ISN'T a person who needs much. Or, rather, he gets what he needs by being a useful person. So fucking up Raven by not being able to give him what he wants is kind of a blow. He was basically AS VULNERABLE AS HE COULD POSSIBLY BE an it wasn't good enough. It's not that he won't return the depth of feelings, he just flat-out doesn't have those resources.
BRIEF NOTE: I mentioned in chan that Yuri is feeling more and more that Vincent is the only one who will have him. Sharon's heartgame ended up happening at a hilarious time because Yuri just keeps getting more and more entrenched into Vincent's world, and he's beginning to think that it's probably just for the best that Raven distance himself from him, since he himself is becoming more distant from Terca Lumireis.